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March 22nd, 2019

Zack Snyder, Henry Cavill Interview, Man of Steel

Zack Snyder’s eagerly anticipated reboot of the Superman franchise, “Man of Steel,” stars Henry Cavill as the superhero who struggles to come to terms with his identity. As a young boy, he learns that he has extraordinary powers and is not of this Earth. As a young man, he journeys to discover where he came from and what he was sent here to do. But the hero in him emerges when he must battle General Zod (Michael Shannon), the rebellious military leader from his home planet of Krypton, to save Earth from annihilation. Opening June 14th, “Man of Steel” also stars Amy Adams, Russell Crowe, Diane Lane, Kevin Costner and Antje Traue.

At the recent press day, Snyder, Cavill, Shannon, Adams, Crowe, Lane, Traue, producers Debbie Snyder & Chuck Roven, writer David Goyer and composer Hans Zimmer talked about their collaboration on the film. They discussed the characters and their arcs, the non-linear storyline, the responsibility of portraying the character of Superman, what made Zod such a great opposing force for Superman, how this incarnation of Lois Lane was different from previous ones, how Zack focused on the humanity of the characters and grounding them in reality as much as possible in this amazing world that he created, the complex stunt work and wirework involved in the film’s heavy fighting, flying and action sequences, and the importance of respecting the iconography and the canon while also telling a great story.

Question: Zack, in deciding what the structure of the movie was going to be and who was going to be the main opposing force in the film, what was it about Zod that made you say, “Yes, that’s a story that I want to tell”?

Zack Snyder: The cool thing about Zod is that he offers a real physical and emotional threat to Superman that is much stronger than any possibly Earth-bound threat. He’s able to not only match him physically, but also he represents his people. So he’s a hard opponent that way.

Q: Zod had a really nice organic reason for what he was doing and for everything that happens.

Zack Snyder: Mike (Michael Shannon) and I talked about it right at the very beginning that we wanted Zod’s point of view to be pretty clear, that if this was happening to your planet and you were trying to save the people that you loved, what lengths would you go to?

Q: Amy, you’re a great Lois Lane in this, but it’s a Lois Lane we’ve never seen before. What attracted you to the part and how did you see this Lois as different from previous ones?

Amy Adams: I grew up watching Superman and loving the characters, and I let it be known that I auditioned several times. This was my third try. So thank you, Zack, for letting me play Lois.

Zack Snyder: It’s my pleasure.

Adams: When I talked to Zack about this incarnation of Lois, what I loved was she was definitely still the intrepid reporter, but she was somebody who was going to be a part of the solution and not just part of the problem. She was going to have more of an inner track on Clark and be on the inside as opposed to being on the outside. I really liked that, and I felt that was a very unique idea. I loved that Zack wanted it to be this big, amazing film, but also it was very important to him to focus on the characters and the truth and grounding the characters in reality as much as possible in this amazing world that he created. He wanted all of the characters to have a really true heartbeat and we spent a lot of time talking about that and that impressed me about Zack.

Q: For Zack, Henry and Hans, music plays a huge part in this movie. What music do you think would be on Superman’s iPod? What hip hop artist or songs would he listen to, to make himself feel super?

Zack Snyder: Oh, you mean his locker room music? His pre-game?

Q: His jock jams. He’s from Kansas, so probably “Dust in the Wind” by Kansas?

Zack Snyder: Kansas. Nice.

Henry Cavill: That’s a really good question and one that I don’t have the answer for right now. Maybe a whole bunch of Hans Zimmer scores?

Zack Snyder: Like “Black Hawk Down.”

Cavill: Yeah. “Gladiator.”

Hans Zimmer: I think that’s on Russell’s (Crowe) iPod. I don’t know. The whole point was we were trying to go and give him some customs, I believe. I hope we succeeded.

Q: Henry, can you talk about what it was like to fly and the stunt work and wire work that was involved?

Cavill: Flight, for one, as to what rehearsal involves, when it came to actual super speed flight, it was mostly belly pan work. Belly pan is the mold of the front of a person’s body and you lie in it. There’s a special gimbal created. So you have a guy in a green suit and a green screen moving it depending on Zack’s direction. I just had to imagine what it was like to fly with lots of help from Zack’s imagery attached to it and his direction. There was also a lot of wirework which we did during the whole stunt process. That was incredibly complex and the guys tested it amazingly. A guy called Jim Churchman just did a fantastic job on the wires. That was probably the funnest part for me as far as flying because I got to be forty feet up in the air and just completely out of control – out of my own control but in someone else’s control, thank goodness – and that was the stuff which made you feel like flight and Superman.

Q: Michael, can you talk about your character’s superpowers and fighting style?

Michael Shannon: It’s mostly Krav Maga. (laughter) No. I think the important thing to remember is, on Krypton, Zod does not have any superpowers. He’s just a general. He’s been training for a long time, whooping butt for a long time there on Krypton. Then he comes to Earth and he goes through a similar thing that Kal-El goes through when he comes to Earth. He’s basically just acclimatizing to the environment. Zod’s been doing those moves since he was a little boy probably.

Q: Antje, have you ever done a movie with heavy fighting sequences before?

Antje Traue: No, never before. This is probably the biggest movie I’ve done when it comes to action sequences. It’s almost like a dance. It’s been choreographed in pretty much every detail, and you rehearse for hours and weeks and months, and then you stand in front of a camera. It’s quite amazing how everything comes together – the costume and the make-up. It’s an amazing moment.

Q: Henry, we use the word “icon” pretty loosely these days, but there is no question Superman is an iconic character. Did you feel any sort of responsibility in playing Superman and how did you find your way into the icon?

Cavill: Firstly, I don’t think it’s about finding my way into an icon. Playing an icon, you don’t try and be an icon because that defeats the purpose. The responsibility attached is enormous, and the realization that it actually really, really matters meant that I wanted to put the most amount of work into representing the character properly, and that especially applied when I was working out at the gym. When you feel that you can’t push any harder or you can’t lift any more weight, you think, “Well, hold it a second. I’ve got to look like Superman. There are a whole bunch of people out there who are relying on me to be that superhero.” And so, it really helped to push out those extra few reps and just become that character.

Q: Can you talk about the arc of Clark’s character. He spends his whole life not fighting, and then, all of a sudden, he’s in this situation where he has no choice. How does he break through that?

Cavill: He broke through it in the period where he gets the sage advice from Jor-El. It’s then when he gets to really test himself. When it comes to the fighting aspect, it’s not really a matter of choice. He has to. And when it comes to characters like that, it’s not really, “Now I’ve got to change my thinking.” He just has to respond accordingly and that required fighting.

Zack Snyder: Don’t forget the first punch he throws is in defense of his mother. If anything, I think it’s instinctual. If someone’s about to throttle your mom, you might throw a punch.

Q: I don’t think we’ve ever seen Kal-El or Clark this conflicted about who he is. Were any classic Superman materials helpful in exploring that?

Cavill: As far as the conflicts that he went through or the journey, it wasn’t about classic Superman material. When you see Clark traveling through the world trying to work out what and who and why he is, I didn’t go to source material for that. I just thought about it and applied my own life to it. As actors, it’s quite a lonely existence. Unless you have someone traveling with you the entire time, you spend a lot of time by yourself. You meet new people. You make temporary family. You love them. And then, you never see them again potentially apart from the odd press conference. You just apply that to the character and that’s exactly what he experiences – new groups of people constantly, and then disappearing and having to introduce himself to these other people and prove to them that he’s a nice guy, and he tries to do all the right stuff. And then, all of a sudden, he disappears again. So, it’s just that lonely aspect which I applied to it as opposed to any classic Superman material.

Q: Amy, I know your daughter is only 3, but what’s a bigger deal to her: “Superman” or “The Muppets”?

Adams: Mines a quick answer. That would be….well, I don’t know. She really liked Henry in the suit, I have to say. She did try to give him a little cheeky grab which was very funny. She wanted to touch the suit and she just happened to be at rear end height. She’s going to kill me when she’s older. So she reached out and gave it a little touch. She’s really into Miss Piggy right now. She just saw “Me Party” for the first time. Today she asked me if I was going to work with Miss Piggy, so…I would say Muppets, but she’s on the fence.

Q: Jor-El is the soul of the movie. Russell, what was the experience for you being that?

Russell Crowe: I have a confession. I might as well just get it out. I’ve never seen any other Superman movie. I haven’t seen any of the ones with that fellow (Marlon Brando) in it or the new young fellow. I didn’t see that either. I don’t have any references. In terms of a cinematic experience, the only Superman reference I have is the 1950’s black and white TV show that was on TV after school when I was a kid. So I don’t really have anything to draw on. The simple thing for me is I read the script. I thought it was a complex and really cool story in and of itself. I thought the problems that Jor-El faced in terms of his decisions as a father was a very interesting thing to do, so that’s why I got involved.

Q: For Zack and David, you both have adapted superhero comic books before into films. Can you talk about the challenges of taking on the Superman franchise and also the decision to not include Lex Luthor as a character in this first film?

David Goyer: It’s a huge challenge. I remember five or six years ago someone asking me at the “Batman” junket whether or not I’d ever want to do “Superman,” and at the time I said, “No.” It’s an enormous responsibility. People have a very proprietary relationship with Superman. A lot of people say, “That’s my Superman.” There’s the Reeves Superman from the ‘50s, the Fleischer Superman, the Lois and Clark Superman, and the Donner Superman. It’s important to respect the iconography and to respect the canon, but Henry was talking about this earlier, at the same time, you have to tell a story. Once you land on who you think the character is and what his conflicts are, you have to let that lead you. You have to throw all that other stuff away and not be worried about this epic responsibility or it will just crush you and paralyze you.

Q: What about Lex Luther?

Zack Snyder: What I was going to say about Lex Luther was … There’s a kryptonite question too that floats around the Lex Luther question and someone asked me, “Well, there’s no kryptonite, no Lex Luther” and I said, “Okay. Within the parameters of this story, there’s no kryptonite or Lex Luther, but that’s not to say…

Adams: I thought I was his kryptonite.

Zack Snyder: No! They don’t exist in the world, but that’s an entirely different question.

Q: As a writer, when you strip it down, what do you think is Kal-El’s ultimate struggle?

Goyer: For me, it was very simple. And it’s interesting that this occurred while I was writing the script. It’s a story about two fathers. While I was writing the script, I became a stepdad and a dad and my own dad died. And so, I never thought that my own experiences would find their way into something like this. But, if you boil it down to that, it’s a man with two fathers and he has to decide which kind of lineage he wants to choose – his Kryptonian father or his Earth father. And, in the end, it’s kind of both that make him the man that he becomes.

Q: Henry, have you taken anything from other actors who have played this character before, and if so, how did you want to be different from them?

Cavill: I did not take anything from the other actors who have played it before. As an actor, the way I do it and the way I viewed it is that, all the actors that have come before, that’s their interpretation of the source material, the source material being the comic books. I wanted to have my interpretation, not out of a sense of ego, but a sense of the fact that it might be a disjointed performance if I have someone else’s personality and their influence affecting the interpretation of the character. So I just went straight to the comic books. Yes, I have watched the older movies, but I did not apply those performances to mine.

Q: All this time Jonathan Kent says, “You have to be secret.” Do you feel Martha feels that way too? What do you think Martha’s take is on this?

Diane Lane: Well, the first time she sees the suit is kind of the answer to the question. I love that line that Reed managed to come up with where she says, “Nice suit, son.” Because it’s been waiting to be revealed, and if anybody’s holding their breath any more than a mom, I can’t imagine who it would be. You know, talk about your son coming out. I’m sort of relieved and grateful and a bit overwhelmed by the havoc that’s wrought coming out of the collapsed house. I love the metaphor of the family album that one would grab. What does one grab in a tornado when something like that happened to your home? It’s the memories and the value system of human life. And what is the value system of human life really and the imprint that we provided to Clarke?

Q: Was there any influence on the suits from H.R. Giger?

Zack Snyder: We talked about it for the Scout Ship and stuff like that. I don’t think directly, but because we had talked about it in the Scout Ship and on Krypton and the costume designers were exposed to all the production designs, it probably seeped in.

Q: Was the Superman suit comfortable?

Zack Snyder: No. I mean, Henry got used to it by the end. Probably by the last day, he had it figured out, but for those months before that, no.

Q: What about the alien spacesuits for the other actors?

Zack Snyder: They were very similar, because if you look underneath all of those, that is the Superman suit. So they basically have to wear the Superman suit and then put another suit on top of it.

Q: Michael, you have the ability to play evil like no other. Where do you go to channel that evilness and who packs a better choreographed punch: Eminem in “8 Mile” or Henry in “Man of Steel”?

Shannon: Satan.

Zack Snyder: Is that where you go?

Shannon: Yeah, that’s where I go. I get my bucket and I go down to the well and I say, “Satan, are you down there? I gotta be evil today.” I lower the bucket down into the well and the lava comes back up and I drink it.

Zack Snyder: You drink it?!

Shannon: I drink it and it hurts, but then I take some Alka Seltzer and some Pepto Bismal. No, I don’t know. I mean, I really don’t know. I don’t. I couldn’t be anything further from who I actually am. I’m just a tall, lanky, goofy person and then I do these other things. I don’t even necessarily ever think of it as evil.

Goyer: I don’t think Zod’s evil.

Shannon: I keep racking my brain. I’m like, “Is my guy an “8 Mile” evil? Why do people say he’s evil?” It’s like people say, “Van Alden, he’s so evil.” I’m like, “Look at all the other men on ‘Boardwalk Empire.’ Let’s line them all up shoulder to shoulder. Now you’re telling me that Val Alden is the most evil person on this television program?” So I don’t really know. In terms of choreographed punch, it’s no secret to anybody in this room that I’m much stronger than Henry is. So there were a lot of icepacks back at the hotel for Henry.

Q: What about you and Russell?

Shannon: Russell really kicks my butt in this movie. I mean, he’s the Gladiator. What am I going to do? Oh, and then “8 Mile,” that fight, wow! What a walk down memory lane. That’s more just kind of an awkward fight really. That’s that kind of awkward fight you have when you’ve just had sex with some dude’s mom.

Q: At the end of that, why not just make unbreaking eye contact with him?

Shannon: Well yeah, but then the lasers might start coming out.

Q: For Russell and Diane, you play such convincing and heartfelt parents even if in different places and times. Where did you go within each of you to get to that point?

Lane: It’s a hybrid of many things. But certainly, once you’re a parent, it informs everything you do. This is such a unique scenario having an alien come into your barn and you raise it, and it happens to be a very beautiful human specimen who actually has got a lot of other things going on. The challenge in the backstory that Zack and Kevin (Costner) and I really enjoyed discussing, which was not part of the script, is imagining what it would be like to temper a young person’s attitude adjustment that’s required in the rearing of children when they have the powers that Clark has. So it was fun having those conversations, and you can fill in the blanks, and maybe there’ll be some funny ones written for the future press story plots. I feel that the love that one has for one’s children…once you fall in love with a being that needs you, you imprint and you want it to represent your belief system. How does that manifest? And what is sacred to you? That winds up being conveyed eventually when you’re not even there to see it. That’s the hope of parenthood. So, “A” for effort and (to Russell Crowe) what do you got?

Crowe: I had a very interesting experience being a father on this movie. I think Zack employed four babies as the recently born Kal-El. And unlike in my own experience as a father of two, I’ve managed to dodge all the piss and the poo, even though I’m pretty slick with a nappy. But, on this movie, I got farted on first. That was okay. I was pissed on. That was a little inconvenient. Then the topic happened under those hot lights. It was after lunch which is to be expected. And I got a handful of the essential Kryptonian material. So I learned a lot. I had new experiences as a parent on this movie that I hadn’t previously had. So thank you, Zack.

Zack Snyder: I just want to add to the tapestry of your life as best I can.

Q: For Mr. Snyder and Mr. Goyer, can you talk about how you decided to go with the non-linear narrative?

Goyer: Anytime I’ve ever been involved in a non-linear story, you start it in a linear manner first, just to make sure it makes sense. And then, you chop it up and move it around. That was a process that we started with when Zack came aboard, and some of it shifted as we were moving on.

Zack Snyder: I think it’s a cool way to do it. You’re with Clark, and he’s making his way, and you’re getting these cool little insights into the why of him. It’s just fun to do it in that way. When he’s facing a decision, you get to see the why of what made him make those decisions. Presenting it in that way allows us to keep the momentum of the story going. You also get an insight into the man in a way that is interesting. It serves the movie in a really fun way, too.

Goyer: Also, I think it was arresting to go from the craft impacting in Kansas to boom, 33 years later, and he’s on a crab boat. It’s just playing with people’s expectations.

Q: How do you bring something of this magnitude to life with 75 years behind it and how do you maintain it and make sure that you stay true to the vision that you guys have for it?

Deborah Snyder: I think when you start thinking about the magnitude of who this character is and how big it is and how big the responsibility is, you could really get yourself paralyzed. So what you have to do is just break it down piece by piece and just look at it as the process. First, it was getting the story right. At its core, Superman has been around for 75 years because of the story. And then, it’s just about day to day seeing what task is at hand, and choosing the right people to bring Zack’s vision of it to life, and casting these wonderful people, the right people, to bring these characters, to make them alive, and choosing the right composer to make the music as powerful and moving as it should be. You just have to look at it day by day and piece by piece.

Chuck Roven: Obviously, a lot of what Debbie says holds true for me as well. I was fortunate that there was already an existing draft of the screenplay when I was asked to join the process, and I was very excited about the potential. I was excited because of the challenge and a bit scared because of the challenge. But that scaredness is what makes something worth doing. We were really blessed that we had a [unified vision]. It doesn’t happen all the time that everybody’s got the exact same vision of what we’re trying to accomplish. The vision that we followed, which ultimately was Zack’s, was in concert with everybody who was working on the movie. And so, it was a great process. It was in that sense, notwithstanding the fact that we shot a huge amount of days and almost three times the normal shooting schedule. The post production process because of the visual effects went for an extraordinary amount of time. It doesn’t really matter how expensive the movie was. You never really think you have enough money to get it all done. It was still one of the most pleasurable experiences that I’ve had because there was never any doubt that we were all pulling in exactly the same direction.

Q: Do you ever look at stuff in the script and go, “I don’t know how we’re going to be able to pull this off,” and then you figure it out?

Roven: All the time.

Deborah Snyder: I think the visual effects, just the action sequences and the fighting and flying that Zack had envisioned and had been working on with DJ (John Des Jardin), our visual effects supervisor, and Damon (Damon Caro), our fight choreographer and stunt coordinator, they were so challenging and it was pushing the limits. I think it builds on things we’ve done in the past, but it definitely pushed them further. You do have to have this leap of faith, because you set out to have this plan of how it’s going to be done, and you’re moving forward with this plan, but you don’t exactly know how it’s going to end up in the end, and you’re just relying on all these amazing artists and visual effects houses to pull through and you have faith in them to.

Q: Henry, I wonder if you can settle the internet debate. How does Superman shave?

Cavill: I think some things are better remaining a mystery. What would people do otherwise, other than talk about it?

Q: Henry, Jor-El says you have to give them hope and I think that’s important for a character that speaks to those that feel like they’re outsiders like the kid who doesn’t really fit in. Can you talk about that kind of a connection?

Cavill: I don’t think he necessarily speaks to the outsider alone. He speaks to everyone, or that ideal speaks to everyone. We all need hope, no matter what century we’re in, whatever state of life we’re in, whether we’re going through tragedy or not. It’s just hope that everything will be okay. And if it is tragedy and there’s disaster happening, there’s hope that we can overcome it. I don’t think it’s solely for those who are outsiders or those that who are alone. It’s for everyone.

Q: I think that’s a cool point because it’s the first cinematic portrayal of Superman where you see him struggle because he doesn’t fit in. He’s not a human but you connect with him on a human level because of it.

Zack Snyder: Yes. Because you think he’s Superman and in your mind you think everything’s going to be great because he can fly and that’s awesome, but then you think, “Wait a minute. It also makes you different.”

Q: And then later he has the biggest coming out story ever.

Zack Snyder: That’s super subtle.

Q: We keep hearing the term “Zack’s vision.” We’ve been hearing about this movie for a long time and you’ve been wanting to do it. What were the magic words you said to get this gig?

Zack Snyder: Kickback I think was the word that I used. Debbie and I went and had lunch with Chris (producer Chris Nolan) and Emma (producer Emma Thomas) and we talked about this Superman project. I remember the first time when we were setting the meeting, it was like, “Hey, you guys want to have lunch? And if we talk about Superman, is that weird?” We thought, “No, no, Superman is cool.” I was worried about Superman honestly as a project just because it’s a thing I was interested in, but then, on the other hand, was scared of because Superman is Superman. It seemed at the time like a lot of work to make work, although I will say that when I read David’s script, and after talking to Chris, there was no fear in the script, in the idea. The idea was very straightforward and very competent. That’s what gave me this feeling of confidence that I felt like, “Okay. There is a thing in there to make cool. There’s a thing in there that I’m interested in. Maybe I need to just let go of the fear of this icon, because I do like Superman as a character and I have followed him throughout the years. The fear for me was that – because I honor what he’s been or what he has the potential to be maybe. I think David did an amazing job with the script, and that was in there, and we just had to go after it. And so, I think the vision was just this sort of unapologetic Superman movie that we wanted to make. In the recent past, I felt like people have been apologizing for Superman a little bit, for his costume, for his origins, and the way he fits into society. We really wanted to just say, “No, no. This is the mythology. This is how it is. And it’s supposed to be this way.” I think that’s the movie we made. We wanted to enshrine him where he belongs. And whether or not that’s making it too important, I don’t know. But it was the way we wanted to do it. So it was fun. It was fun to do.

Q: The score in this film is terrific. Could you and Hans talk about your collaboration?

Zack Snyder: Thank you. I worked on it really hard. (joking) I brought a guitar one day, and then I broke it because I can’t play a guitar. No! The only thing I’ll say before I let Hans talk is that before we began working on the music, I got questions about the music from early on. Once we announced that we were going to make the movie, you get on the phone and you think you’re going to talk about “Oh, you’re making a Superman movie. That’s great. What’s your take? Blah, blah blah.” Instead, it was, “Are you going to use the music from the other film, from the John Williams score?” I’d go, “We haven’t shot a frame of film yet. I don’t know that.” But that’s how we knew that music was out there. It’s a strong piece of music, but our philosophy, of course, was we wanted to act as though no films had ever been made. We wanted to act as if we’d found these comic books under our bed and said, “Hey, this would be a cool movie. We should make this Superman into a movie.” Because we had taken that point of view, there was no cherry picking of stuff. You couldn’t go, “Hey, it’d be cool if we just borrowed these couple little things. That’s fine. Right?” So we knew that everything was going to be from zero. I was hoping…we talked early about it. ”Chris, do you think when you’re down there talking to Hans about your other movie, could you twist his arm or bribe him somehow into working on my Superman movie?” I don’t know exactly what was said, but for whatever reason he agreed. So I don’t know if there are pictures or what it is exactly.

Zimmer: Well, I was a reluctant bride, because not like Russell, I had actually seen the other Superman movies, and I just think John William’s music is incredible. So, a couple of things happened. Chris said to me, “C’mon, you could do the Superman movie,” and I kept saying, “No, I can’t do the Superman movie.” Because the big difference was when you (Zack) went into Warner Bros. with the idea for a Superman movie, you actually had an idea. I had nothing. And then, Zack and I started talking. His vision is completely, entirely the only reason the score exists. It’s because he took me by the hand and went, “This is what I want to do.” And I’m going, “Yeah, I can feel that.” The other thing is he’s a great artist. He doodles. He draws. And that’s a great language for me because – David, I think you can forgive me for this – the way we started was I said, “I don’t want to read the script. Tell me the story.”

Goyer: That’s how Zack and I started. He drew pictures.

Zimmer: Because then I knew what was in his head. Here’s the thing. I know what it’s like to be a foreigner. I know what it’s like to be an outsider. I have no superpowers.

Goyer: Oh, c’mon!

Zack Snyder: Yeah, exactly.

Zimmer: The other thing that both Zack and I thought was really important was this idea of hope, that we would celebrate something. We would celebrate an America that has not been celebrated in so long and just be genuine and right from the heart. And then, there came a moment after three months of procrastination when Zack said, “Hey, you got anything yet?” “Oh…uh…I’ve got some sort of post-its you can put up on the fridge.” He said, “I love post-its. I love doodles. I’ll be down on Tuesday.” And then afterwards, he confessed that Chris actually had said to him, “If you’re not going down to Zimmer’s place, you’re never going to hear anything.” So that’s how we did the score.

Zack Snyder: It’s funny, too, because one thing that I think is interesting, and one thing that comes through the score, is there are big events in the film, and the score is amazingly supportive of those events. There is also the thing that Hans did that I think is amazing, and we talked about it even before I heard it. We had said “Oh, it’d be cool if the Superman score was humble, if there was humility in the score.” In the Superman theme, if you will, there was humility in it which was really hard. It’s abstract. I just said, “Humility. Now make that into music,” whatever that means. Thank God I’m not a musician because I would never do that to him. Right? “Oh, it’d be cool if the score was more humble.” It’s like, “What the fuck?” I’d probably laugh. And he’d probably think, “What the fuck?! That guy! I want to kill him.” But you hear it and it’s in it. He says he doesn’t have any super powers, but you hear whatever that is, however many notes that is just in that little thing, and you go, “Wow, that’s humble.” Well, I just said it. Somehow that happened musically.

Zimmer: I love to be humble about it. We play the piano, and one of the things I really have to be humble about is my piano playing. It’s sort of weird because all these great pianists are trying to play this tune and it just didn’t sound right. It had to be the bad right hand here.

Zack Snyder: It’s cool.


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